GoB needs more active players - some ideas the devs should listen to!

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Comments

  • QuietTime wrote: »
    I'd agree that chaining needs to be nerfed.
    As it's essentially a product of lag, there should be a desire to deal with it regardless.

    My BIG gripe is suiciders. More and more players are suiciding lately, and not just the alts and noobs.
    I'm seeing more than a few ranked players that basically just suicide through entire rounds, and it's a discouraging tactic to new players and vets alike.
    Why would someone want to stick around the game if every time they play, some body just suicide bombs them 20 times and gets a medal for it?
    I think we need to institute a scoring mechanism that will discourage this kind of behavior. Something that takes into account the K:D ratio when ranking and awarding medals.
    As it stands now, certain players can take medals by being less skilled, which is discouraging to new players.
    There's no incentive to play well, if you can just trap yourself with other players repeatedly to get kills, and score high regardless of how many times you've been killed.

    If the suicider is getting the medal and you are not, and the suicider is ranking higher than you, maybe its your paradigm that needs adjustment, and not his behavior.

    As I have explained on the forums, suiciding auto shielders is a logical and ethical response to the power asymmetry that results from some players using protective add-ons (auto shield among so many others), while other players relying solely on their fighting skills and the standard power ups available to all players every round. Suiciding the perker brings him down to the same level as the purist.

    Plus it (suiciding) is rewarded in the loss probability algorithms. You are more likely to retain kick, for example, when you die if your deaths are greater than or equal to your kills. I have pointed out this moral hazard out to the mod & devs on the forums before, but as it stands, its like a tax loophole: the smart people take advantage of it.

    All you're doing is rationalizing poor skills.
    Further, auto shielders are one thing, suiciding non-stop is another.
    From day one folks have pointed out that deaths, not just kills, should be taken into account, otherwise what stops crap players from simply suiciding every time and racking up bigger scores?
    No one's ever bothered to fix that, though, and now we're seeing what happens.
    Armies of alts, some mains, all suiciding and wrecking gameplay.
    If, indeed, the probability of retaining certain powerups is higher because your death count is higher, then that is also a point that needs to be addressed.
    But stating outright that suiciding is the "skilled" or "smart" way to play is fallacious, at best.
    There's far more skill in winning a round without constantly killing oneself in the process.

    LOL not that any of this matters, since the devs are essentially AWOL at this point.
  • edited September 2017
    _Salty_ wrote: »
    LazyABB wrote: »
    The bomb chain doesn't really take a lot of skill, it's tweaking you computer keyboard settings to do it.
    explain.

    How to easy chain [includes windows setup]

    How to turn while chaining [basically buy a gaming keyboard]

    How to puzzle chain

    Great Japanese player doing puzzle chain
    Thanked by 2 0x42 Stranger_Butts
  • QuietTime wrote: »
    QuietTime wrote: »
    I'd agree that chaining needs to be nerfed.
    As it's essentially a product of lag, there should be a desire to deal with it regardless.

    My BIG gripe is suiciders. More and more players are suiciding lately, and not just the alts and noobs.
    I'm seeing more than a few ranked players that basically just suicide through entire rounds, and it's a discouraging tactic to new players and vets alike.
    Why would someone want to stick around the game if every time they play, some body just suicide bombs them 20 times and gets a medal for it?
    I think we need to institute a scoring mechanism that will discourage this kind of behavior. Something that takes into account the K:D ratio when ranking and awarding medals.
    As it stands now, certain players can take medals by being less skilled, which is discouraging to new players.
    There's no incentive to play well, if you can just trap yourself with other players repeatedly to get kills, and score high regardless of how many times you've been killed.

    If the suicider is getting the medal and you are not, and the suicider is ranking higher than you, maybe its your paradigm that needs adjustment, and not his behavior.

    As I have explained on the forums, suiciding auto shielders is a logical and ethical response to the power asymmetry that results from some players using protective add-ons (auto shield among so many others), while other players relying solely on their fighting skills and the standard power ups available to all players every round. Suiciding the perker brings him down to the same level as the purist.

    Plus it (suiciding) is rewarded in the loss probability algorithms. You are more likely to retain kick, for example, when you die if your deaths are greater than or equal to your kills. I have pointed out this moral hazard out to the mod & devs on the forums before, but as it stands, its like a tax loophole: the smart people take advantage of it.

    All you're doing is rationalizing poor skills.
    Further, auto shielders are one thing, suiciding non-stop is another.
    From day one folks have pointed out that deaths, not just kills, should be taken into account, otherwise what stops crap players from simply suiciding every time and racking up bigger scores?
    No one's ever bothered to fix that, though, and now we're seeing what happens.
    Armies of alts, some mains, all suiciding and wrecking gameplay.
    If, indeed, the probability of retaining certain powerups is higher because your death count is higher, then that is also a point that needs to be addressed.
    But stating outright that suiciding is the "skilled" or "smart" way to play is fallacious, at best.

    There's far more skill in winning a round without constantly killing oneself in the process.

    LOL not that any of this matters, since the devs are essentially AWOL at this point.

    No "if"; it most definitely is. The point was addressed in another thread, and the mods mentioned they did it that way to help out noobs.
  • Thanks for the link Otto, I found the thread and responded there.

    I get the thought process behind that adjustment, but I think the unintended consequences outweigh the benefit, unless scoring reflects those deaths.
    Thanked by 1 BabyThanos
  • I'd argue that chaining for kills takes a lot of skill, or else everyone would be a master at it by now. On my keyboard, I have to release and press space again everytime I change direction, instead of simply holding the button down the whole time (as can be heard on my mechanical keyboard in one or two of my videos).

    If you are a player known for chaining, people come up with creative ways to block your chains, sometimes before you can even start them. Even bots can often block my chains. That means you have to have fast reflexes and make instant adjustments to avoid killing yourself.
  • @pwnyy Most players who have played the game for over a year have found the ways to deal with the bomb chain. I am merely pointing out if you go play a new game for the first time and you die 30 times from someone who have no idea how to approach, on 90% of the matches you play why are you going to stay playing. The purpose to it build the community not scare off any new potential players.
    Thanked by 1 0x42
  • LazyABB wrote: »
    @pwnyy Most players who have played the game for over a year have found the ways to deal with the bomb chain. I am merely pointing out if you go play a new game for the first time and you die 30 times from someone who have no idea how to approach, on 90% of the matches you play why are you going to stay playing. The purpose to it build the community not scare off any new potential players.

    long ago, back in 2013 when i started to play i had 2 kills and 30 deaths. i was so happy when i watched muimui, syme, tommy, ccrimson, assholekid and sadlex playing this game. they were amazing! even back in the old days. their amazing playing style gave me more power to keep continue and became a better player! i wanted to be just like them. then later when i made 15 kills and 13 deaths i was soo happy! i think i started to gain more kills then deaths after 6000:6000. now i have 94287:39039. even tho im a noob and i dont have style, i think i made a good progress! and i have to say that most of the time im perkfree! and i use shield only when i get the free one after 5 days. but that last only 4rounds... oh and i have horrible 300-500 lag so i cant even make a style. im happy if i can kick a fcking bomb. what i wanna tell u is: watching amazing players playing game is the biggest incentive. if ppl get killed by style its ok. but when a suicidal noob autoshielded ass run into u.. thats annoying. just like the meaningless kicking and bomb spamming. believe me i was happy to run in muimui's chain. but not to stop her... i always thought she is the best so i gave her lots of free kills xD now what is ur story? why u keep playing?
  • Nevada wrote: »
    LazyABB wrote: »
    @pwnyy Most players who have played the game for over a year have found the ways to deal with the bomb chain. I am merely pointing out if you go play a new game for the first time and you die 30 times from someone who have no idea how to approach, on 90% of the matches you play why are you going to stay playing. The purpose to it build the community not scare off any new potential players.

    long ago, back in 2013 when i started to play i had 2 kills and 30 deaths. i was so happy when i watched muimui, syme, tommy, ccrimson, assholekid and sadlex playing this game. they were amazing! even back in the old days. their amazing playing style gave me more power to keep continue and became a better player! i wanted to be just like them. then later when i made 15 kills and 13 deaths i was soo happy! i think i started to gain more kills then deaths after 6000:6000. now i have 94287:39039. even tho im a noob and i dont have style, i think i made a good progress! and i have to say that most of the time im perkfree! and i use shield only when i get the free one after 5 days. but that last only 4rounds... oh and i have horrible 300-500 lag so i cant even make a style. im happy if i can kick a fcking bomb. what i wanna tell u is: watching amazing players playing game is the biggest incentive. if ppl get killed by style its ok. but when a suicidal noob autoshielded ass run into u.. thats annoying. just like the meaningless kicking and bomb spamming. believe me i was happy to run in muimui's chain. but not to stop her... i always thought she is the best so i gave her lots of free kills xD now what is ur story? why u keep playing?

    Kudos. GOB needs more hardworking players like you who avoid shortcuts, and less lazy ones.
    Thanked by 1 0x42
  • @Nevada I know how it was too, but you need to look at it from 99% who try the game and quit. If 1 in a 100 continue to play after trying the game, but in that time 2 or 3 regular players stop. The game will slowly diminish. So unless you want servers to be 3 or 4 players for majority of the day. I call that a game that will eventually fail. It doesn't matter that the players who are here now kept going till they got good. I rather play in a server where there is 100 like 4 years ago. Players weren't training bomb blasts killing 20 people in a single chain. I like a challenge, but that's not a challenge. It's boring, there is no skill, no predicting players moves, no timing after the first blast, no real attempt to actually playing the game. It's one players running either back and forth or in a circle doing the same move. If you think that is skill then you think standing in a corner throwing 8 bombs from a safe distance, running away when a player approaches you and repeating must be skill.
  • @LazyABB Thank you for brining this up! I agree that it is verry annoying for new players if they die instantly because some other players chain around. But i don't agree with your words about it like its an unskilled technique. I am not the person of meassurement but it took me a long time to do it like i do it now and i belive it took others also a specific amount of time! So your suggestion to nerf it or put it completly away makes me sad :/ Instead i think there is alrady a good solution for this! There is the "Easy" room where players of a certain rank above cant enter. And you cant tell that a new player already has the felling of "oh, there is the normal room and easy room, so lets take the normal room because the easy one is noobish". Even if they start playing in the normal room, after they die instantly because of chainig they got the wish to do it too or they will take the easy room (as long as they are not scared!)
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  • I consider it an unskilled technique since it doesn't require any strategy to use. I can do it, but it a very risky move to use. I'd say on a scale for skill it's at most a B ranked move. A ranked moves are ones that usually involve timing a kick or something and moving out of the way. Only real S ranked move I would say is one I can't do to well, and it involves laying bombs and throwing/kicking bombs to be timed to blow up right when the other bomb is kicked or tossed in the way.
  • LazyABB wrote: »
    I consider it an unskilled technique since it doesn't require any strategy to use. I can do it, but it a very risky move to use. I'd say on a scale for skill it's at most a B ranked move. A ranked moves are ones that usually involve timing a kick or something and moving out of the way. Only real S ranked move I would say is one I can't do to well, and it involves laying bombs and throwing/kicking bombs to be timed to blow up right when the other bomb is kicked or tossed in the way.

    haha, I can time bombs with some level of accuracy but chaining isn't really something I've mastered! sometimes I do some small-medium chains, but I certainly wouldn't call myself good at chaining!
  • I have read all the comments and happy with their ideology, here are my agreements and suggestions in simple lines

    1. SUICIDAL BOTS and damn more crazy green monsters, i hate so much because logic is bad, they are always faster than me, before i realize slimes have trapped me with their crazy block sizes bombs, no escape, keep getting killed
    2. BOTS are way too intelligent yet suicidal, remember the computer algorithm will win against human response
    3. MAPS are crazy, i made some tests and bots can detect me in full grass of stealth map (i like them yet), big black holed maps are really waste
    4. PLUTO collection is rare, and skins are expensive (I have paid lot of dollars for 1000 pluto, and i could buy only 10 skins) (moreover a new player will take atleast years to gain 100 pluto, so he cannot buy skin)
    5. SKINS are not that good, no offence, some skins are very nice but most are like spam designs (I am a good designer / developer, let me contribute for skins atleast)
    6. POWERS needs to be improved (shield regenerator takes lot of time to recharge can hardly generate 10 shields per game) (so many powers lost without realizing they are active)
    7. INTERFACE needs to be improved a lot (minimize sidebar, optimization for 4k screens, non tabbed game stats)
    8. SUPPORT ing players should be there to help newbies, i usually help new players and give them goals, talk to them where they are from, how what works etc... if there are some dedicated players to do that it might address the concern of @0x42 (less players) @Gally used to help me
    9. UPDATES of what has been improved in the desktop version, If i am not wrong i donated for it and yet I have been waiting for a desktop version and didnt know who to ask.
  • Gally wrote: »
    _Salty_ wrote: »
    LazyABB wrote: »
    [snap!]bt's tweaking you computer keyboard settings to do it.
    explain.

    it was that remark that I was referring to, but thanks for the vids @Gally
  • edited September 2017
    LazyABB wrote: »
    I consider it an unskilled technique since it doesn't require any strategy to use.

    That's not true and a bad argument xD Look, i will compare chaining with bomb kicking. So for bomb kicking you don't need a strategy, too! You just need the power up, thats it^^ You can spam bombs by kicking them around without a strategy BUT you can also kick bombs with a strategy like you described above. AND it's exactly the same with bomb chaining EXCEPT that chaining requires a lot more than just a power up ;D You can chain around without a strategy and i would say that's even more skilled than spaming bombs without a strategy, but you can also have a strategy while chaining (start a chain at a specific time to not die because other bombs would kill you if you start to early or combine bomb kicking with chaining).

    Look at the people playing, almost everyone kick bombs, but only a few use chaining. Why? Because it requires effort to handel it (:
    LazyABB wrote: »
    I'd say on a scale for skill it's at most a B ranked move. A ranked moves are ones that usually involve timing a kick or something and moving out of the way. Only real S ranked move I would say is one I can't do to well, and it involves laying bombs and throwing/kicking bombs to be timed to blow up right when the other bomb is kicked or tossed in the way.

    Since you need timing and a lot experience (knowing the game and the laags, looking around while chaining to deside which direction to move on and knowing when to stop to not die!) i would consider chaining for kills as one of the top ranked moves in GoB!
  • @0x42 It takes practice but once you get it down it's a simple trick. Why at least I see 1 or 2 guests per game doing it. Plus any normal starred player doing. It's not an unstoppable move, but I was saying it scares of a large % of new players. The needs balances on certain tricks, especially when it is an open map. Only a few players know how to stop it a high % of the time. If those players aren't on then there is one guy just running back and forth the entire match with flames following. Getting 50-60 kills easily with maybe a mistake suicide in there.
  • @LazyABB stop complaining about chain! chain is NOT AS BAD AS NOOB bomb spammers with auto shield and + flame! there is z and his biatch sergo. they are just running like crazy and spamming bombs and suicide a lot bcoz the auto shield! i hate those kind of assnoobs but i dont flood the forum with my complainings. u should stop....
    Thanked by 3 Stranger_Butts 0x42 syme
  • Nevada wrote: »
    @LazyABB stop complaining about chain! chain is NOT AS BAD AS NOOB bomb spammers with auto shield and + flame! there is z and his biatch sergo. they are just running like crazy and spamming bombs and suicide a lot bcoz the auto shield! i hate those kind of assnoobs but i dont flood the forum with my complainings. u should stop....

    Plus, they use full perks and kill newbies/low-ranking players (even cross-teambombing), yet they they think they are pro, muahahahaha!! For the record: I use perks too, but don't brag about it, let alone I consider myself a "pro" :3
    Thanked by 1 0x42
  • Fine whatever let the game slowly decay not like we are getting new players. Just more fake guests. I am merely pointing out a way to keep new people in. The chain bombers don't kill me often, usually once a game. If I know one can do it I merely watch out for it.
  • @LazyABB yeah the game is slowly dying but its not bcoz the chain. more like the noobassperkers and the high ping.. thx god soon the desctop client will be finised. right @Excuse_Me ??? we still wait the update. anyway we have a @pwnyy and he got a lots of new players in the last few days. if the devs will accept pwnyy's help, im pretty sure US will be the most active server.
    Thanked by 1 0x42
  • Ping hasn't been bad. Must be your settings on the computer or you picking the wrong server to play on. But even when I play on RU or EU it's still no bad for me.
  • I think suiciding is too op. I just saw a round with almost everyone in the top 5 having like 15-20+ deaths. And believe me, it wasn't skill from using low powerups. xD I think the real problem is new players getting suicided every 2 seconds because people aren't losing any/enough powerups when they kill themselves every 5 seconds.

    Also, as a result, it's almost impossible to keep any blue bombs. If you have 3 blue bombs with a shield and get hit, you lose one. Then if you die before you collect more, the other 2 are gone. I personally don't think losing blue bombs discourages shield suiciders. All it does is give people another reason to suicide on you instead.

    Anyway, this is just my opinion and experience from playing today. I'm trying hard to get more players in the game. 45 referrals in the past couple days. : )
    Thanked by 1 Abbey_2030
  • I think the timer for shield is increasing per game every time you lose. I think the suicides have been getting worse too. They need to make the scores based of kills and deaths. I dunno how to stop trolls from doing it with guest accounts... But that is why I don't think guests should be allowed to play in the normal server. If people want to test out the game, guest accounts should only be able to enter tutorial and monster rooms. Maybe team play. Same with low ranked new accounts, this will stop players from creating 100 accounts everyday to stay anonymous.
  • I hate it when you and another player are in a small spot waiting for bombs to explode and they just suicide there :(

    It's not very fun, but that's what makes the game hardcore! I still hate it though haha : -) I don't know a way to stop it though!
  • @ham_ I use Jetpack a lot for those situation. Don't risk it just blow them up and jump away,
  • edited September 2017
    Big thanks to the players who have made constructive suggestions!

    I've just returned to the development after more than a month of absence due to life events and I'll try to address some of the issues described here soon.

    Some changes that have been made in the last couple of days:
    1. Fixed server crashes (for now on EU and US, soon on other servers too).
    2. @Hackerham has fixed DEV server.
    3. As has been suggested here, ID server is closed.
    4. Some technical improvements to the moderation system (they're important, but only moderators will see them).
    5. New arena maps are added, some arena maps changed from 6 to 4 players to make entering easier.

    Some changes coming soon:
    1. Monsters will be less aggressive.
    2. Unfortunately, advertisement doesn't seem to be possible, but I'll make some search optimization which will lead to more players finding the game.
    3. Bosses will appear more frequently on smaller servers.
    4. Change teleport platforms to make entering arenas easier when multiple players standing on the same platform.
    5. Change how items are lost on death to make constant suiciding not a viable tactics.
    6. More bugfixes...

    Some mid and long-term goals.
    1. Overhaul of the skin prices and categories. Skins unlocked on certain ranks is also a good idea.
    2. Desktop client, as soon as @Hackerham starts working on it actively again.
    3. Female skins constructor (we have some sprites, only need to combine them).
    4. A button to transfer plutonium to another account in the profile (on the same conditions as now, but instantly without messaging admins).
    5. Improvements to the moderation system: when someone is muted off-line, they'll see a moderator's name and an explanation; better automatic duration calculations.
    see_ya wrote: »
    SKINS are not that good, no offence, some skins are very nice but most are like spam designs (I am a good designer / developer, let me contribute for skins atleast)
    You can submit new skins we'll add them to the game. Message me if you have any questions or propositions about skins. https://forum.gameofbombs.com/discussion/12/submitting-skins-to-the-shop
  • 9 months later
  • Well, i just wonder how everything goes on. Almost 1 year... and nothing better...
  • A lot of those things on the list were done. I think the main thing that players want to see is desktop client (the new game engine) done. Image this: they complete the project and send an email newsletter about it with some free pluto to all players, new and old. I think a lot of them would come check it out.

    Also, advertising the game is very important to keep new players coming in. It's very difficult to reach enough people for free. If money is the problem, I'd like to help sometime with that. We need more players on all servers.
    Thanked by 2 banana_sama ham
  • they should give us 100 pluto as compensation for this ducking long waiting time. 100 free pluto will give all of us a better mood and im pretty sure damn lots of ppl will come to buy a skin and check the game out. or just buy perks and play some lagless rounds. and if they see that lots of ppl playing, maybe they will stay too.. so DEVS DONT DUCKING MESS WITH 5 PLUTO. GIVE US 100!
    Thanked by 2 pwnyy server_down
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